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Tibetan "Anti-Han" protests spread

posted Monday, 17 March 2008

ACB was going to avoid this topic for a while, and then post an analysis on it when more reliable information was available, but it looks like things are spreading, and that Beijing may soon have to issue an executive order: Commanding Chinese security to either step up and to escalate in order to maintain its grip on power, or to stand down in order to maintain Face in front of the international community in the run up to Beijing 2008.

From the BBC

Tibet unrest spreads beyond Lhasa

Tibetan protests against Chinese rule have spread to another part of China, after days of demonstrations and violence in Tibet's main city, Lhasa.

Clashes between Tibetan protesters and police in Aba, Sichuan province, saw a police station and cars attacked.

Rights groups said several people had been killed in the clashes, though this could not be verified.

The violence came after exiled Tibetan leaders said a Chinese crackdown had killed at least 80 people in Lhasa.

Indian-based officials said the figure was confirmed by several sources, even though China had put the death toll during Friday's riots at 10.

The Dalai Lama has called for an international inquiry into China's crackdown, accusing it of a "rule of terror" and "cultural genocide".

Sichuan protest

The clashes in Aba, known as Ngawa in Tibetan, happened around 1200 local time on Sunday, according to Kate Saunders of the International Campaign for Tibet.

Eyewitness: Lhasa 'in cinders': The lay people and monks seem to have joined together in a protest... which was focussed around the police presence in the town," she told the BBC.

She said that more than 1,000 monks had been on the streets of the town, which is home to a large monastery.

"According to reliable reports the police opened fire," said Ms Saunders, who is in London but said she had indirect phone and web access to eyewitness accounts. "We know there have been deaths."

Accounts of how many people died differ, but she said the most reliable eyewitness source put the toll at seven.

Reuters news agency cited an unnamed police officer in Aba saying that Tibetans had thrown petrol bombs, burned a police station, and torched vehicles during the clashes.

The incident followed protests on Friday and Saturday in a Tibetan area of the neighbouring province of Gansu, when monks and demonstrators confronted police in Xiahe.

Crackdown

In Lhasa, where rioting erupted on Friday after days of mainly peaceful protests, Chinese troops were out in force.

Hong Kong Cable TV reported that about 200 military vehicles, each carrying 40 to 60 armed soldiers, had driven into the city.

Loudspeakers broadcast messages, such as: "Discern between enemies and friends, maintain order."

China tightly restricts Western journalists' access to Tibet and it is sometimes extremely difficult to verify what is going on.

The BBC has learned that troops in Sichuan province have been recalled from leave and put on standby.

Death toll dispute

The Chinese official news agency Xinhua says 10 people died on Friday, including business people it said were "burnt to death".

But the Tibetan government in exile later said at least 80 corpses had been counted, including those of 26 people killed on Saturday next to the Dratchi prison in Lhasa.

The demonstrators, who on Friday set fire to Chinese-owned shops and hurled rocks at local police, have been penned into an area of the old town by government forces.

The authorities in Tibet have urged the protesters to hand themselves in by Monday morning, promising leniency to those who surrender.

In an interview with the BBC, Tibet's spiritual leader the Dalai Lama said he feared there would be more deaths unless Beijing changed its policies towards Tibet.

"It has become really very, very tense. Now today and yesterday, the Tibetan side is determined. The Chinese side also equally determined. So that means, the result: killing, more suffering," he said.

China says Tibet has always been part of its territory, though Tibet enjoyed long periods of autonomy before the 20th Century and many Tibetans remain loyal to the Dalai Lama, who fled in 1959.

The unrest erupted a fortnight before China's Olympic celebrations kick off with the start of the torch relay, which is scheduled to pass through Tibet.

The Dalai Lama emphasised that he still supported Beijing's staging of the Olympic Games this summer, saying it was an opportunity for the Chinese to show their support for the principle of freedom.


It's probably worth noting that Beijing has just recently begun blocking Youtube because of it's coverage of the riots. Also that Beijing has pressured Nepal into banning tourists from hiking anywhere near the border in order to prevent foreigners from coming into contact with Tibetans. CNN and BBC world are also being jammed at regular intervals in order to prevent the broadcast of news stories about Tibet.

ACB thinks that it is probably a good thing that this is the Olympic year, else we'd see a lot more dead and injured.

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1. Florencia left...
Monday, 17 March 2008 8:10 am

I am a journalist in Montevideo, Uruguay, South America. I produce a journalist programme. I would like to be able to acceed to tv reports on local tv of China, in particular with all that is happening in tibet. Is there any web site or can I find anything on-line? Can anybody help? florenciamelgar@gmail.com


2. Jack Tupac Pennington left...
Monday, 17 March 2008 10:26 pm :: http://trickythicklines.blogspot.com/

Human, I am outraged by the state of the world, but specifically at the moment with this ordeal in Tibet. I am a bit suprised that your blog is not at the top of the list seeing as the British newspapers here The Independent and The Times report that some kind of ultimatium has been issued to all protesters at 16:00 London Time. I am worried about all of the people who are involved and the families of people who live here in Europe. Genocide of a culture has been taking place around the world since the first explorers went to conquer foriegn regions on the planet. It hasn't stopped and the situation is not unique in this factor, but what is unique is that this involves one of the last surviving cultural communities the planet has left. One could very well call this The Last Cultural Stand. You may be asking yourself as you read on through this posted comment what are you doing effectivly with action to boycott the things taking place. Well today when I started reading yet further into the news on this topic...I have been following this for quite some time and even started my own blog about it quite some time ago at http://trickythicklines.blogspot.com/ and I have a very passionate view on this regardless of the obvious political conotations of this event. I am curious to know first hand what exactly is happening so if you can please contact me I would very much appreciate it. So would many other people. I work as a freelance journalist in London, and I am an independent writer as well...so I can make your voice echo across the 7 seas as long as you provide me with a clear concise depiction of what is happening. My only vested interest is in the safe return of the planet to a harmony that can be tolerated by all, and at the current stage this is not possible. As the Dalai Lhama said himself (I am not a buhddist) Both sides are equally prepared to stand up for themselves thus killing is the result. It is an obvious fact that he has stated and that fact although it be fact is a very alarming state of humanity as a whole. I leave my words there. P.s. sombody should start a boycott against the HSBC bank. I changed my account today to a diferent bank after asking a clerk if this was going to effect my account and when he replied that he didn't even know what was going on I went directly to another bank and started the process of transfering my money elsewhere. Everybody knows whats going on but they don't know that action is the only movement in change! Peace, Love, and understanding unto you, Tupacamaru


3. miloservic left...
Wednesday, 19 March 2008 4:07 am :: http://hi.baidu.com/miloservic

I am Chinese but know nothing about Tibet history, so expecting your analysis.


4. The Masked Millionaire left...
Sunday, 23 March 2008 4:24 am :: http://themaskedmillionaire.com

China is a thug country. Take the Olympics away from them. People are dying and we are concerned about playing basketball?


5. ACB left...
Sunday, 23 March 2008 4:47 am

There's very little that China has done to Tibet that America hasn't done to the Native Americans and England hasn't done to just about everybody under its domain who doesn't have a white face.

Maybe we should take the Olympics away from England for its continued support for China?


6. chines boy left...
Sunday, 30 March 2008 5:57 am

我要为藏人说句实话

  • 我是一位多年在西藏工作的汉族老干部,最近在藏区发生的抗暴事件即 是我意料之外也是意料之中的事,为什么这么讲呢?在我一生中最美好时期是在西藏度过的, 在这期间,我结识了许许多多的藏族农牧民和干部,老师。在长期的交往中,我深深体会到藏民族是个非常纯朴,与人为善而 热爱和平的民族。他们把佛教的教义利他作 为一切行动的准则,坚信因果报应理论。在不断的交往中,他们中的很多人成了我的朋友,而且有幸在与他们交往中我学会了说藏语,这后来成为与藏族沟通购的最好的通 行证。与他们交流,只要你以诚相待,他们从来不把你当作外人,他们说藏人和汉人都是一样的人,只要你对我好,我们一定也会以礼相待。在西藏真正尊重藏民族语言文 字使用,真正尊重其风俗习惯的汉族人赢得了藏民族的尊重,也成为了他们的朋友。时时互相关心,互相帮忙。从这一点来讲,最近藏族人民不顾生命危险,群起抗暴使我 十分惊讶。但从另一个方面来讲,这是我预料之中的事。冰冻三尺非一日之寒,这是逼上梁山的结果。因为我在长期在藏工作中深深了解到这个民族悲惨的命运,而且我十 分同情他们,我不觉要问他们的悲剧是 谁造成的???

刚进藏时,我与所有汉人一样,总是以解放者的姿态出现在他们面前,认为我们把他们从奴隶制度下解放出来,他们应该感激我们。但不然,在与他们的不断交往中,我发 现事情远不是我所了解的那样,在与他们不断的争辩中我完全被他们改变了,我了解到他们感觉,体会到他们的苦处,在这我想把我所了解的一些写下来,以供世人参考。 早在50 年代,共产党政府以解放为名,占领了西藏,使得以达赖喇嘛为主的西藏政府不得不背井离乡流亡到印度,无数藏人被杀。共产党占领西藏后,以破四旧为名 ,破坏寺院,关押和杀戮僧人,大量的典籍一灰炬之 ,近似新的焚书坑儒。以共产党的生活方式代替藏民族的优良风俗习惯,以帮助藏民为名大量的汉人移民到西藏,以 汉语言文代替藏语文,以唯物论代替藏民族的宗教信仰使这个佛国净土弄得乌七八糟,民不聊生。在文革期间,藏民族遭受的灾难,比中国境内的任何民族还残酷,因为受 害于共产党派系斗争外,动不动就扣上民族主义的大帽子。使得藏民族不敢谈论有关藏语文和宗教方面的问题,我的一位昌都朋友曾告诉我昌都地区一位藏族领导,在拉萨 开会期间提了要求重视藏语的意见,还没等他回到昌都,他的乌纱帽就在途中已没了,那还是90 年代的事。
  • 对一个民族来讲,要完全放弃自己的语言文字,重新学习另外一个民族的语言 文字是一件不容易的事。尤其是当另外一个文字被作为招工招干提干,升学的条件,更是困难的事。想象一下如果中国人被迫放弃汉语言文字,用日语或其他文字来生存会 是什么样子?我是连想都不愿想。我们会体会到什么滋味?当藏文濒于灭亡之时也就是改革开放,思想大解放后的80年代 当年在班禅大师的要求之下出台了一个学习实用藏语文的方案,但班禅大师圆寂后,这一方案成了有名无实的孤儿。

    • 被称为与国际接轨的90年代 ,西藏有许多特殊的政策包括对西藏宗教的高压政策,例如,在宗教上进行在了所谓的寺院爱国主义教育,限制寺院中的僧人年龄和人数,禁止使用传统的学经制度,禁止 僧人流动。政府 官员分组入寺让僧人表态与达赖的关系。有些僧人因宗教感情原因拒绝反对所谓政府宣传的达赖是破怀宗教的人。因此使他们失去了继续留在寺院的资格 。寺院爱国主义教育使原本宁静的寺院,弄得鸡犬不宁。有一次我那位昌都朋友告诉我:在西藏昌都洛龙县干部入寺逼迫僧人表态与达赖喇嘛的关系,有位僧人实在不怨骂 达赖离寺而去,而当地干部认为他是在逃跑,就派兵追赶,僧人见到有解放军在拿枪追赶,就拼命逃跑,当士兵看到他继续逃跑时向他开了枪。在寺院爱国主义教育过程中 发生的诸如此类的事情举不胜举。寺院爱国主义教育也起到了意想不到的作用。这就是入寺干部学到了不少西藏历史和宗教知识。原本这些干部是去给僧人讲西藏是祖国不 可分割历史的, 但平时在办公室里以看报纸喝开水打发日子的他们哪里懂多少西藏历史文化知识,一旦离开发放的宣传材料除了瞎吹外什么都不懂,一问三不知三问九摇 头。反而和尚们给他们讲解西藏历史和宗教知识。众所周知,在藏区,不准人们佩戴和悬挂达赖喇嘛的像,在拉萨,藏人被迫拆毁神龛,而且,明文规定国家干部和工作人 员不准信神拜佛。比较荒唐可笑的事是,班禅圆寂后,中国拒绝承认达赖喇嘛按照传统的宗教仪轨来认定的灵童,他们另立班禅灵童,而且由国务院总理李鹏来批准,这不 知是 否符合中央一再谴责旧西藏政教合一的 原则。不知国务院总理李鹏继了那个大教派的传承和不知他是个哪个大寺院的"高僧大德",否则,哪有那么大的加持力来 认定班禅灵童。在这我想问一下胡锦涛和温家宝,被带走的那位班禅灵童如今 在何处? 但愿不要作为暴徒和分裂分子来处理。另外据我所知,当年马年(2002)西 藏阿里地区冈仁波钦马年盛会,各地香客纷纷前往阿里时,西藏自治区党委宣传部下令截下了一辆辆前往阿里的香客的车,并把它作为一大 功劳,原西藏自治区党委宣传部长苟天林(此人现已升任为光明日报社总编辑)向自治区党委领导上报他的这一战功。

    • 在我离藏之前,中央先后开了几次援藏会议,会后确实有些"成果"。出台了十三项援藏工程, 十七项 援藏工程,在西藏的几个主要城市里耸立 了起了几座现代气派的建筑物。这是给广大的农牧民盖的吗?我不相信,我想可能是为更多的新移民创造条件的。难怪,胡耀邦总书记曾大骂西藏的领导把中央给的钱扔到 了雅鲁藏布江里。中央援藏会议的另一个成果是,派援藏干部。各省市以提干,提工资为条件动员干部去西藏短期挂职锻炼。这些人到西藏后与当地干部分享权力,成为书 记,县长,主任,处长等等。他们不懂当地实情,凭生搬硬套内地经验办事,其中不少人经常与当地干部包括老西藏发生冲突,不是帮助当地干部把工作搞上去,而是带来 领导班子间的不和。因此当地干部并不要求援藏干部留在西藏,只要他们从内地搞来点援助经费他们就可以待在内地。另外,地方上安置援藏干部困难很多,西藏地方本来 就不富裕,援藏干部到来之前要准备好套房,家具,办公室以及各种设备,既要照顾好援藏人员不失职,又要照顾好地方财力有限。所以有些地方就明确要求不要援藏干部 来。此外,援藏干部只是短期挂职,因此他们只是打发时间而已,没有把心思真正放在帮助当地发展和建设上。吃,喝,嫖,赌,尽可能为自己办事,是他们在藏期间的任 务,他们身在曹营心在汉。所以援藏干部成了当地人民的负担。

    • 在我西藏工作期间,我知道中央从来没有信任过藏族干部,西藏的第一把手从来是汉族或其他民族来委任。而且任用的大都是一些其他民族地区担任过领导 角色,思想很左,整治少数民族心恨手辣的人,如 原西藏自治区党委书记陈奎元(现此人荣升为全国政协副主席)是在内蒙臭名昭著的迫害蒙古民族的罪人,他曾在西藏 会议上公开讲过藏族干部不能信任。现在的张庆黎也是来自新疆建设兵团的左王他对整治维吾尔族有一套,对造成西藏抗暴他们也负有不可推卸的责任。

    • 在陈奎元任职期间,除了进行所谓的寺院爱国主义教育外,还停招 西藏大学藏文专业三年,其理由是藏文教材里包含佛教内容。他抵制藏语文的学习和使用。在很多级别较高的职位不让藏人担任,而且藏族干部不能有不同的声音。当然他 们是中央在西藏的代表, 他是在 执行中央的在藏政策。其实我们很多汉族知道陈奎元是个严重搞不正之风的人,他妻子大部分时间住在北京驻京办事处,利用丈夫的身 份高生意,他的儿子倒卖高级轿车。曾把100辆林肯高级轿车高价倒到他父亲任职的西藏,引起了极大的民愤据说这笔生意未能如愿。

    • 西藏当官的很会享受,西藏自治区政府原设有10多位副主席,他们轮班工作,由于 西藏冬天相对寒冷,领导干部们们大部分在内地疗养享受,遥控指挥西藏的工作,老百姓叫他们是 "冬虫夏草"或"候鸟"。夏天内地炎热时避暑到西藏。他们能为西藏老百姓办事吗?

    • 我一个朋友是拉萨附近的农民,前一段他心情很不好,据他反映,官商勾结强行征用拉萨附近 农民的土地(拉萨火车站等),而给农民少量的补偿,农民有意见,找自治区领导,自治区领导直言:你们聚众上访是搞分裂,如果你们再闹,一点钱都不给,看你们怎么 着。他请我找人帮忙,他说他们家带不起这么大的帽子,还告诉我在拉萨附近的农民,为了口饭,握着一把铁锹,等待有人来找他们干活,但往往从早等到晚找不到活路干 。

    • 西藏也是全国最大的假冒伪劣产品的倾销地,凡是在其他地方销售 不了的东西,都运到藏区去处理,在藏区人们随处可见来自甘肃,青海四川的回 族,汉族商贩们把劣质产品载上架子车上走街串巷地区卖,美其名曰方便群众,薄利多销。广大农牧民和底层的城市居民,往往受害于这些东西,新鞋穿不了一周就破了, 他们哪像国家干部有很多钱,一双破了再买双。特别是假药,劣质食品的泛滥更是害人不浅。所以,有门路的人利用到内地出差或托亲朋好友去内地去时买。据听说国家技 术监督局的一个调查组曾赴藏产品质量调查,其结果,发现几乎所有产品为不合格产品,难怪人们称西藏的政协人大代表团为采购团,因为他们利用每年在京参加两会机会 大量给自己和亲朋采购东西。

    • 现在藏区实行一种 叫退牧还草的政策。听起来好像是保护环境的很好的政策。但其主旨是剥夺牧人放牧于自己几千年土地上的权利。在几年里政府给他们一点钱,让这些牧人移居到城镇来, 但政府给的钱,往往不够用于购买房子和生活开支。另外牧民离开自己的土地,离开自己的生蓄后很难习惯于城市生活,更严重的问题是他们没有赖于生活在城市里的现代 专业技术,所以这些人的的命运很悲惨,导致社会很多社会问题。

    • 在教育战线,广大的农牧民的子女,成绩再好没有前途。一则父母没有钱供孩子送内地西藏中学或境内的中学,大学。即便父母凑上钱,也没有象干部有 后门送孩子去学习。农牧民的孩子虽学习刻苦,成绩良好,但考学时,他们的成绩总被有门路人偷走。考卷上改名 换姓就变成了干部子女的名字了。说高考时西藏考生有 分数照顾,但有门路的高干们把自己和亲朋好友的子女的临高考前把户口转到西藏,占走了西藏考生的名额。考完后户口仍遣回原籍。另外,教育脱离西藏现实生活,所学 知识离现实差距太大,如果这些人考不上大学,那么他们很难找到工作。很多来自农区和牧区的子女,若升不上去,那么往往成为没有用的人,这些人既不能在农区,牧区 跟父辈一起搞体力活动,又没有知识另谋生路。他们成了家里和社会的负担。

中国对外宣传中,口口声声地称西藏广大的农牧民享受免费医疗,但事实根本不是如此。广大农牧区缺医少药。而且药物基本上是过了期的药和假药。得到这些药也不容易 ,除非你是医生的亲朋好友。要搞好与医生的关系,你必须要长期送礼,保持好关系,否则,你将被医生另眼看待,自己也在医生前面处于低三下四的境地。除了得大病以 外,小病小患自己忍着不去看病,因为花不起这个钱。因此,大部分人因病而死,且不知病因。在国外藏人争得钱一半要花在家人和亲友的医药上。由于假冒伪劣产品充斥 藏区市场,低质大米面粉,食油,腊肉等各种食品的冲击,使传统的藏民族优良的饮食结构正在被代替,使得藏人的健康越来越得不到保障,藏人过去没有得病现在层出不 穷 藏族人的圣城拉萨外地人越来越多,相对反而藏族人变得越来越少,很多工作岗位被外地人抢占。过去区,乡上有些藏族的商埠,如今被外地的商贩所击垮了或处于被 挤垮的趋势,他们的生意只是收购虫草,贝母类的草药而已。藏人在自己的土地上生存越来越困难。如今的八角街不再是藏族商人的天地。
  • 班禅大师曾经直言中央领导, 西藏失大于得。为什么这么讲呢?人们只知道中共宣传的每年给西藏拨多少多少亿的钱。但从来不报道,每年从藏区掠夺了多少资源 。在藏区原有的原始森林被砍伐,秃 山随处可见,具有人统计,过去每天从川藏线上运往成都的木料多大5000量卡车,对中国江河的源头藏区掠夺性的砍伐,导致了中下游地区的洪灾不断,因而不得不下 令停砍。为了大量砍伐森林, 曾在四川甘孜成立了一个森工队而且这些人都是来自具有良好砍伐经验的东北大兴安岭森工。当甘孜藏区山上的树砍光后,如何安置这些人 ,解决这庞大的森工队的生路成了甘孜州最大的负担之一。藏区矿产资源远远不断地挖掘后运往内地,有些非常珍贵稀有矿产地禁止藏人靠近。人们质问:到底 政府给藏区输血还是抽血?

  • 在藏区,自中国占领近50 年来,生态资源遭到了前所未有的破坏,除森林资源遭到灭绝性破坏外,野生动物资源日渐减少,原本与大自然融为一 体的西藏,现成为了野生动物的地狱。藏族为保护野生动物,经常要与外来的偷猎者发生冲突。众所周知的 例子是为保护藏羚羊治多县县委藏族副书记索朗达杰献出了他的生命。

  • 目前,西藏所存在的现实问题一个比一个严峻。在干部队伍贪污腐败,行贿受贿走后门,拉关系之风日益严重,政府的口号是稳定压倒一切,只要有 人不喊西藏独立,其他什么歪门邪道什么都可以搞。不说别的无数个妓院已开到了自治区党委人民政府门口,联上西藏军区,人们把这条街称为党政军妓一条街。人们私下 把自治区的领导的名字以他们拥有的不义之财的钱数来称呼如,张千万,向百万 等等。

  • 我不想谈更多的事,我们已经给藏民族造成的灾难太多太多得了, 我们有不可推卸的责任。这累累罪行,早应该向藏民族低头认罪,赢得他们的宽恕。但可悲的事,最近又发生了。我们又在西藏,阿坝,甘南藏区屠杀了无数个 僧人和贫 民,甚至近日来,内地有些城市的旅馆,饭店拒绝对内地出差或看望西藏中学学生的藏人登记住宿。我们为什么容不得让他们表达自己的一点意愿游行示威,难道必须以开 枪来解决处理游行的事吗?想象一下如果这样,那么美国每天会有多少人要死于游行呢?。但只有中共政府的武警战士和解放军战士才有这样的勇气把枪口对准人民,执行 上级的命令,大开杀戒来建立"和谐协社会"如今我真无脸以对我的藏族兄弟朋友们。我们口口声声地在讲,藏族和汉族是同一个妈妈生的女儿,他的妈妈叫中国,大唱藏 汉大团结。如果是同一个妈妈生的孩子,那么为什么不让孩子表达自己的心意去游行,反而开枪杀害自己的女儿。这不就说明这母亲不是亲生的母亲,而是一个虐待女儿的 继母。

  • 我们曾批蒋介石的民族政策, 但蒋介石从来没有下令开坦克进拉萨血洗圣城。 也许他不知道枪杆子里出政权的伟大真理吧!此时我真的不知道如何面对我那些称兄道弟的藏族朋友? 请问胡锦涛主 席大屠杀藏族是你所倡导的创建"和谐社会"意思吗?杀人容易,结怨不难,但你要如何修补你们所造成的藏汉民族间的鸿沟?所造成的藏民族对我们汉人的仇恨?这新仇 旧恨,由 你胡锦涛来解决还是你温家宝来解决。你们要知道杀人是要偿命的,你们不是看见萨达姆侯赛因的下场了吗?


7. Snowlion left...
Sunday, 30 March 2008 6:24 am

Dear chines boy, I believe you are one of the only sensible Chinese people who know the real situation in tibet. Thank you for the help.


8. julndy left...
Sunday, 30 March 2008 11:52 am

I am a mainland chinese who has live in Europe for almost of half of my life. I am stating this because I don't believe anyone can be truly separated from one's education, own social, class standing to make a real objective judgement. Aren't we all "pre-programmed"? "China lives in the past and its past ingrained ino its people" I think you have said something like that. I find it is hard to forget one's past history, surely histories shaped us today. Isn't this what we are, why are, how we are today? Anyway, my point is for a nation like mine, (I can't help being biased, in my defination, china includes tibet) what do you suppose we could do? let every single province independent, have city kingdom like Italy during the middle age? If tibet gets its independence, just how we draw the new borders? I read somewhere Dailai lama's brother had interview many years ago in France, he wants an autonomy region which includes some whole or part of other provinces (I don't how true it is), which amounts to 1/4 of chinese current territory. If that is the case, what should the governemnt do? Does Beijing government have the right to give away other ethnic groups' traditional habitats? what about the other ethnic groups already settled in Tibet? what will happen to tibetans live other part of mainland? Could you imagine how little to take to start a bloodbath? It will be on both side, I suppose the death of hans (or just chinese as we been call by the general media in the west) will not be heavily weighed on others' mind, as we are evil, and there are so many of us. So should Beijing retaliate? if it doesn't how can it answer to its people, if it does, tibet will be under occupation again. It's a wasp nest. Maybe I am too brainwashed up, but really who will like to see one's own homeland to fall apart? You call us being nationalistic, but I guess only those who almost lost or had lost their own countries, like the jewish, understand the importance of having country of one's own. ( Don't use this ask me back how the tibetan will think, I was brought up to think we are same nation depsite different ethnic origins. Call me naive, but how could be anything else but fasination and immens pride of all our ethnic groups) Maybe as a nation we have not get over our past lessons learned "Might is Right", maybe we can't yet to imagine how to be small and beautiful. And this will certainly not be achieved by next generation nor next governement. But just what has Beijing govenment done so evil, so out of ordinary to be labled as such? It only wants to hold a country together, keep the territory intact, keep our own sovereignty, gives most of its people sense of security from foreign invasions (I am from the same generation as you are, still hung up with wars 50, 150 years ago, maybe this will be essence of chineseness you were looking for). It seems most our brainwashed, badly educated, ill informed, closed minded, ingorant and yet arrogant, money hunger, martialist mainlanders (I am very aware of the ugly sides of my national traits,15 years in europe seems changed little of that) and this governement deserves each other, so why all the fuss. Leave us be, if don't want to be infected by us in any way, isolate us from internantional community, stop buying, strip away our "economy power", it is quite simple. then china will be in choas, we will be fight each other, and kill each other which we had so much previous training, we are quite good at it. then voila, world is much better place for all. If the world does't want to see that, then stop rocking the boat, let us change at our own pace, or with our 5000 years of history, we still don't know what is good for us?So who can teach us then? Don't mean to be sarcastic, if it gives out such impression, I appologise, forgive my english, not a native speaker after all. Another unrelated to this tibet subjet, I can't help wondering, why you choose to stay in mainland china? The impression from reading through your blogs, I think it is fair to say that you find the government is oppressive and aggressive, people materilistic and full of ugly traits that you despise, culturly uninteresting and barren, environments heavily polluted, commerce without conscience. What's keeping you there? are you one of those china obersers or political analysist, as your knowledge about China and its history is very impressive. I genuinly want to know, not trying to offend you.


9. julndy left...
Sunday, 30 March 2008 1:28 pm

another point, ACB what do you suggest the first steps to solve the Tibet problem? If the Chinese government really committed all those things as the chinese boy said, which has cause the huge divide and deep resentment between the two ethnic groups. Let Dalai Lama back is unrealistic, as both sides are too stubborn, if dalai lama himself is non political, how about all the people around him supported him, who can be sure those have not got their political ambitions and agenda? A racial cleansing is a not unprobable. Look what happened recently, it is very easy to loose control. that goes on the both sides. And current international portrait of china, and attacking Beijing government and its entire population (Tibetans excluded) will not help, only breeds a hostile sentiments among the most of Chinese, as you can see from all the posting on the times' website. It only fanned the idea of "us Chinese" against "them, the west", then, the entire point of giving Tibetans a better life includes religious freedom, etc, will be lost. What do you suggest to do with maybe large number of han chinese like me, due to brainwash or propaganda whichever you will call it, nevertheless have taken tibetans to our hearts, part of our own national identity, part of our heritage. We will feel hurt, and will be very much pained, a deep sense of loss. I am not talking about national pride, or losing face, etc. I am talking about losing the fibre of what we are. Just like the 5000 years history, the great wall, the ethnic diversity is our pride and joy. Sure one can't ask another suffer as the chinese boy has described in order to satisfy one's pride and joy, I fully understand that. 50 year compare to chinese entire history is only split of a second, but it is pretty much a life time for those who live through it. As much as pro-tibet camp pointing out that the tibet has never integrated to chinese main society, but it has integrated enough to have any kind of simple, clean solution.


10. dave zimmerman left...
Tuesday, 1 April 2008 6:06 am

Julndy,

I thank you for the sincerity of your post. I most appreciate the fact that the strongest emotion your displayed was frustration, instead of the type of anger that blinds analysis. Defending your country out of love for the good qualities you believe it stands for is natural, and doing so without attacking other peoples' hope for their country shows a truly noble spirit.

One thing that you need to understand about the Americans' point of view of their own countries is that they can hate their government, yet still love their country. Their love of their country and the ideals they associate with it can even lead them to hate their government. After our election in the US is over, a minority may think that the government is evil, and they will feel free to say this. They love the fact that they can question whether the government respects or betrays the ideals of their nation.

With this in mind, please understand that it is possible for Americans to be critical of another country's government without hating that country's people. If you think that Americans hate Chinese people, you should come to Los Angeles and see how many Chinese people are finding prosperous lives here. If you think that Americans have contempt for Chinese ways, you should know that I am a practitioner of Traditional Chinese Medicine (just the herbs, not the needles), and my neighbors would rather come to me when they are sick than to a regular doctor.

So let me share part of our national myth with you. Please understand that this is all set against the background of 200 years of religious war in Europe that make the struggle between Taoists and Buddhists during the Tang dynasty seem like a tea party. It concerns freedom of religion, which is one of the phrases which evokes an automatic response in Americans.

The ideals that Americans treasure most are associated with religion; the freedom to follow any religion you believe in is guaranteed by the fact that our constitution prohibits the government from being involved in religion or favoring one religion over another. Most of the history of the United States is tied to religion. Most of the original settlers in the first New England colonies came here to escape the English system of control over religion. In England, you had to attend the official church or pay a fine; if you belonged to the wrong church, you couldn't take part in politics at all - no voting, no holding office.

In the early American colonies, you could not have religious ideas that were different; freedom of religion was alright, but only for your own religion. Many of the colonies in New England were started when groups of people were kicked out of their homes for having different beliefs, so they made a new start for themselves, and, in turn, kept people with different beliefs out of their own colonies. The modern state of Pennsylvania was originally a colony for Quakers, and Maryland was started by Catholics. In Virginia, started by believers in the official English church, it was the law that any Catholic priest caught in the colony would be hanged.

Even after our War of Independence and for almost forty years after the adoption of our Constitution, towns made laws against people of other religions - they could not vote, hold office in the government or even own property.

But a large nation cannot be governed like this, and federal law, based on the promise of religious equality in the Constitution, overruled the laws of the small towns. So now in the US, we have more religions than you can count.

If you can access www.yellowpages.com, look for a listing of churches in a major American city. There are more than you can count. There are all types of Christian sects from all over the world, all the major religions of the world, and some strange cults that you will only find in Hollywood. There is even a religion started by a science fiction writer who decided that he could make more money if he started his own church; the founder died a long time ago, and the church owns more and more real estate in Los Angeles every year.

The freedom of all these churches is guaranteed by law, and the government needs some powerful reasons (or ways to get around the law) to interfere with them. The church that owns all the property (I can't mention it by name, or its lawyers will take all my money) is as free from taxation as the poorest church. When Jewish synagogues get vandalized, the police arrest the guilty people, and after September 11, the police were protecting Muslim mosques. Catholics are free to recognize the Pope as the leader of their religion. Native Americans are free to use hallucinogenic mushrooms in their religion, something which is against the law for the rest of us. A Buddhist in America does not have to apply for permission to be reincarnated.

I apologize for this long history lesson, but it important for me to explain why Americans feel concerned about what is happening in Tibet. It isn't a question of whether Tibet was part of China 5000 years ago or fifty; it's a question of the relation between government and citizens.

I have focused specifically on freedom of religion, because I have known people who left China for exactly that reason. The office next to my work place is owned by Tibetans who import Tibetan goods from Nepal and Thailand; they also own a restaurant that I eat at occasionally. I also got to know two Chinese ladies who live on my block; one is Catholic, the other is falun gong. Their English isn't very good, so I can't understand their explanation about how they got those deep round scars on their hands, between the bones leading to fourth and fifth fingers, but they can say who did it. I do understand how they got the scars on their faces, though.

I am aware that the government of Tibet before 1959 was oppressive. But I would think that all the oppressors have left or have been reeducated, so I don't think the Tibetans who are demonstrating are doing so in favor of the return of such a system.

I am aware that the CIA sponsored Tibetan guerrilla groups in the past. But just as Iraqis don't need Osama bin Laden to tell them what to do, the Tibetans don't need outside leadership to become angry.

I am aware that the United States has funded propaganda and subversion against Chinese rule in Tibet, but do you think that all the lies and all the dollars in the world can persuade people to do something they do not want to do?

The Americans who are most active in their support support of Tibet are Buddhists, or think they are. The majority of Americans who support Tibet without being Buddhists do so on the basis of feelings that were formed long before China achieved the status that it has today, so it is not out of envy of China's economic power or fear of it's newly revived military.

The topic of this whole essay, and the goal that I think is dear to the hearts of Tibetans, is freedom of religion.


11. ACB left...
Wednesday, 2 April 2008 4:19 am

For those who do not read Chinese. Chinese boy is they used to think that Beijing was saving the Tibetan people from poverty and briging them modern benefits, but after seeing things for themself, and after speaking to many local people they came to realize that many Tibetan people didn't feel the same way, and they came to see things from their perspective instead of from Beijing's. For example the in wanting Tibetans to be like Han Beijing is forcing them to loose some of what they traditionally are, and that Beijing is purposfully interfering with Tibetan spirituality by training monks in Han thinking in order to control Tibet and Tibetan thinking and to surpress non Han idealogies.

They also became aware that many of Beijing's policies which were supposed to have been brought in for the right reasons actually had bad effects on Tibetan life, such as programs to prevent errorsion which harmed Tibetan nomads hurding cattlem while and the measures that were supposed to compensate them have turned out to be inadiquate, and often counterproductive.

In closing, they now feel that What is happening in Tibet is deeply wrong.

Don't take my word for it, If your Chinese isn't so good, dust of your dictionary, and if you can't read simplified Hanzi, find a friend who can. A thought provoking read, though ACB can't speak for the source.